kidchameleonfandomcom-20200213-history
Talk:K-E
01-22-2013 K-E is being ported to Java! I'm a better programmer nowadays, so I have been able to get away from structured programming and embrace object-oriented concepts. My decision to do this in Java has to do with Java having a very rich array of classes that make it easy to write this type of application, and the fact that I write Java code for a living. The code so far is very well organized, something that I can't really say about the old version. All art, tile and block layout data can be ripped from the ROM and displayed on screen. Right now, I'm working on getting enemies to display. I hope to have at least a small following like the one I had with the old version of K-E. The goal with this new version is to allow every aspect of levels to be able to be modified and imported into the ROM. ::I'm really excited to see your working on a new version, also have seen your pervious version which is already amazing. Do you think it would be also possible later to make your own KC-version, with that i mean changing the level structure? or am i talking crazy stuff XD ? ::And if i can help you with providing icons, or any of that kind let me know. Haagnus (talk) 09:11, January 26, 2013 (UTC) :: ::I don't know about changing the level structure. That might be slightly crazy =) But certainly there will be more flexibility in this version compared to the C version of the program. I'm really pushing for this one to be full featured with no unreasonable limitations whatsoever. ::Saxman727 (talk) 00:49, February 12, 2013 (UTC) 02-11-2013 The Java rewrite of K-E is coming along well. Right now, it can display any enemy or player sprite from the game, and it can use any three palettes assigned to each enemy (including ones that went unused). It is also able to display any map (minus objects and blocks). The underlying functionality is about 60% complete. After that, the interface would have to be put into place. Posted here are some snapshots of sprites viewed through the program as it stands. Saxman727 (talk) 00:46, February 12, 2013 (UTC) :: Great to see you back Saxman! These sprites are some great finds! Maybe we can use them in Stage 5 levels ;).Is it possible to edit the ripped sprites and then reinsert them back into the ROM? :: Also, have you discovered anything else to do with the structure of the game code? :: Adolf Hendrix (talk) 21:01, February 12, 2013 (UTC) 05-05-2013 Amazing to see those unknown color tables, I wonder for which level they where intended Stairway to Oblivion? Maybe we can add them later to the enemy list but of course with a nota. And how is it going with the new K-E, in the new languages code Java? --Haagnus (talk) 17:55, May 5, 2013 (UTC) 07-07-2013 Sorry I haven't written anything lately. I've been very busy with life. I did manage to fit in more research in regards to K-E. Since there's not a whole lot of tangible details to discuss, I thought I would instead outline a sort of preliminary plan I have for the first release: * Data will be saved in XML format so any fool with a hex editor can change it. It also makes it easier to support in other programs since XML is a standard format, unlike KCM and KCT files which are 100% proprietary. * Other configuration aspects will be editable too. Details are preliminary, but I'm thinking music-theme assignments, color palettes, graphics, physics definitions, and more. An initial release will likely NOT have all of that, but may have one of two of those listed. Maybe. * Tile, block, and enemy layout will all be part of the release. The big let-down with the current software is enemy layout editing was never implemented, greatly under-valuing the software as a result. So this version I'm working on should absolutely have it all. I would also like to have platform layout editing, although it is not currently being considered critical. I have no release date in mind. For now, I'm going with the "when it's done" approach. As I get further along, I will consider setting a formal release date. On another note, I'd like to mention that I like the idea of posting projects/maps on the wiki. I already played one and enjoyed it, even if it was short. I think we should consider using IPS patching as to avoid posting actual ROMs (which can lead to issues with them being taken down). I'd like to possibly make a program that will make importing maps into ROMs a bit easier. We'll see. Saxman727 (talk) 03:03, July 8, 2013 (UTC) : Hey, great to see you back! I would like to suggest two things which may/may not be possible: #Even if platforms aren't editable, at least display them somehow in the editing window - it's annoying to keep going back and checking platform locations and movement. #Make it possible to extract the edited levels from the ROM, because both Skarloey and I have accidentally overwritten our edited KCM files and were ensaddened. : I agree with the IPS patching point, I'm planning to do that with the next release of KC2 that I put up (which may be a while in coming -.-). Out of curiosity, which project did you play? I'd appreciate it if you would play Kid Chameleon 2 and Blue Lmao Woods from my Projects page if you haven't had the chance. :D : Tyadran (talk) 18:54, July 8, 2013 (UTC) :Hey, Saxman727 great to hear something from you again. You keep surprising me with K-E. I thought in the next version it would be only possible to edit enemy positions. but it looks like we're getting one big update XD, I'm looking forward to the new version of K-E --Haagnus (talk) 18:06, July 9, 2013 (UTC) : 08-11-2013 The new K-E now displays the tile layout, block layout, and enemy layout of a level. As you can see from this picture, the enemies show up a bit funny. That will improve. But compared to the last public version of K-E, this is a step forward. Less noticeable is that not all the block art is being used. Only a single sprite for each type of block is currently being used. This too will improve. All of the sprite data you see is pulled directly from the ROM. Another area I have dedicated some time to is optimizing it so it draws on the fly. It's difficult to talk about it since the Java version has never been shown to anyone, but before it took several seconds to draw the entire screen. Now it draws everything on the fly. That's a big deal, and it gives me confidence as a programmer that I can make this version of K-E into a fabulous piece of software. Stay tuned for further updates! Saxman727 (talk) 04:05, August 12, 2013 (UTC) Hey Saxman :D this Project is awesome, i have a question, in future versions, it's posible change the pallete of enemies in the map? or have planned that? Skarloey100 (talk) 03:43, August 12, 2013 (UTC) Yes, I plan to have all the enemy definitions for each map editable. Saxman727 (talk) 04:05, August 12, 2013 (UTC) That looks incredible! I'm curious whether you're planning on adding platform and theme-change support, especially fixing the background movement issues that go with the rough theme-changing I've been doing. Also being able to add murder wall/hail/etc. in-level would be quite nice, as it gets frustrating when K-E overwrites any direct hex editor changes I've made when I import new levels. Also having it not overwrite level order every time would be fantastic, especially since (as you may have noticed) I'm playing around with level structure in KCX. One other wish - I'm not sure how possible it is - is if you could manage to fix the issue where block data overflows into the background, bugging it up. It's possible to work around, but I have to do quite some modification on already-completed levels to lower the block count, and it may disregard some cool ideas in the original build. Anyway, thanks for sharing, and I can't wait to see how much further this comes along in the next version! Tyadran (talk) 12:14, August 12, 2013 (UTC) 10-22-2013 I've been incredibly busy with real life stuff. I have a wedding to help out with. My job requires plenty of my time. Still, I have managed to get some work done on K-E. In addition to getting enemies to display correctly as they would in the actual game, I have also done work on cosmetics. In the screenshot, you'll notice I have scroll bars attached to the window. I think most people probably prefer scroll bars over arrow keys in any application, K-E being no exception to that. Here's a progress report on what I have accomplished: - Tiles (done) - Blocks (partially implemented) - Enemies (done) - Platforms (not started) - Natural occurrences (not started) I'll be excited to start on platforms soon! Saxman727 (talk) 23:35, October 22, 2013 (UTC) Great work Saxman! I can't wait to see this version of K-E :) Skarloey100 (talk) 23:38, October 22, 2013 (UTC) Okay, forgive me, but I am unhappy right now, because I wrote a long, thoughtful comment, and it wouldn't publish because Skarloey edited the page before I finished. So here is a condensed, less specific version: : Nice work, and thank you for all that you do. I have 4 comments, those being: #Will it be possible to view everything but hidden paths and blocks (i.e. keep those unshown), especially for the purposes of making .PNG maps without revealing all of the hidden blocks. Conversely, could it become possible to export an image of the current map with the current viewing settings? #Will it be not broken on Windows 8 any more? I have crashes when I scroll too far and when I close the kidedit window. #Can there be a function to automatically delete all tiles or change the cursor size to copy/paste/delete larger section? It makes new-map creation for projects a lot easier. #Can the arrow keys still be an option? I personally like them, unless we can mouse-wheel scroll horizontally as well. Then I said something about how I may be asking a lot and only consider that which you wish to, thanks for everything and making this all easier for the rest of us. Tyadran (talk) 23:51, October 22, 2013 (UTC) ---- Wow Saxman727, I'm every time more excited with the progress you have made. It already looks perfect to me :-) enemies visible, new art for the hidden walls, which looks great. Despite of we can't see what's going on inside the program, which properly have taken a lot of effort. Therefore i am also very grateful to you, for all the work that you have done. I'm looking forward to the next update. A little while a go i did made an new icon for K-E, it's the same you have used only slightly different, and made two sizes 16x16 and 48x48.ico, They are uploaded here on Wiki if you're interested. --Haagnus (talk) 18:15, October 23, 2013 (UTC) 02-22-2014 So, it's been a while! Life has been filled with many busy days. I have been helping with my upcoming wedding, doing web design on the side for extra cash that goes toward the wedding, and helping someone who is currently trying to leverage SonicAmp (a sound library I wrote a few years ago in C++) in a potential commercial game. On top of all of this, I work six days a week. I am pooped! If you haven't gotten the hint, here it is spelled out: I haven't done much at all to the K-E rewrite! This is unfortunate, because I was hoping to have been much further than this a year out from when I started. I haven't forgotten about it, and I haven't forgotten the people who have been following these posts I have made. If you can wait a little longer, I promise I will try to deliver something tangible this year. I will post here again when I have some sort of update to provide, so you can still rely on this being your source for information on the K-E rewrite. In the meantime, I'm glad to see this community, no matter how small it is, still alive and well. I like seeing the screenshots of projects from time to time, so I hope to see more progress from you guys! Cheers! Saxman727 (talk) 05:02, February 22, 2014 (UTC) Hey there. First of all, I'm glad that you see our projects on the wiki and that you will continue with K-E! I really need give you the thanks for create this wonderful tool. I recommend you connect on the wiki chat when you can cuz there's users who have a lot of questions to you. And well, again thanks for create this great tool Saxman :) Skarloey100 (talk) 05:33, February 22, 2014 (UTC) hey Saxman727 congrats on your upcoming wedding. i wish you the best. and thanks for even giving us a super cool tool to make our own edits, i'm looking forward to seeing any new updates you give us. any will be welcomed, thanks again :) - Drios1 (talk) 05:44, February 22, 2014 (UTC) 06-21-2014 It's been a while! I started working on K-E again recently, and I am pretty happy with the progress I've made this past week. I focused most of my work on enemy layout editing. You can move enemies around, and you can make multiple selections at a time. There's no way to insert new enemies or delete existing ones, but that's coming. I also worked on adding some basic user interface elements. The new K-E will be more mouse oriented as you will see from the screen shots. The right side of the window will be where all your editing tools appear, much like what the Allegro-based version of K-E was just beginning to have implemented in it's last release. Once enemy layout editing is done, I will begin implementing editing capabilities for tile and block layout. After that, who knows? To be perfectly honest, there's still a whole lot more to do that hasn't been started. This includes platform and natural occurrence editing, saving, exporting data, theme editing, completing the UI, and more. With that said, I don't believe it has to be completely finished before I can release something to the public. I am open to the possibility of releasing a limited version capable of reading and writing KCM files. Stay tuned! Saxman727 (talk) 04:04, June 21, 2014 (UTC) I'm pretty happy of hear that. You don't have idea how anxious I'm for your new version, I was sure that one day you'll return around here XD Altrough it's already possible edit enemies; platforms; geysers and a BIG etc. it's very difficult and takes A LOT of time, personally, I just hope you could finish this, cuz will facilitate the way of making stages. Oh, well, I'll keep looking forward for K-E! Be well and take care. Skarloey100 (talk) 04:45, June 21, 2014 (UTC) Good to see that progress is being made, I'm certainly looking forward to this new version. My only comment is that background editing would be nice to have, especially if you know how to edit the background animation/scrolling. For that matter, even any hex knowledge you had on that would be wonderful, as that is one of the main annoyances to me right now - it makes my levels feel incomplete and weird. Good to hear from you again! Tyadran (talk) 16:49, June 22, 2014 (UTC) Oh man, I'm really loving the progress here. Maybe we can see many interesting ROM hacks finally come into play with this! Superjustinbros. (talk) 02:35, July 6, 2014 (UTC) 05-21-2016 After yet another break, I started back up on development, and I have a goal of releasing a demo within the next month or two. I have been working hard on refactoring code to read level data from XML files as opposed to the ROM itself. Once this is done, I will make an initial release. Saxman727 (talk)